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102614-what-could-carbine-do-to-improve-wildstar
Page 1, Page 2 Content ---- ---- Nah that will send it F2P and NCsoft likes to Sunset their F2P games. They can start actually listening like they claim and take suggestions on how to fix things and bring people back. | |} ---- ---- ---- Why? Megaservers as they've been implemented have had their own problems, but I'm sure there are compromises that don't suck. Dead servers are one of the worst things that can happen to an MMO, and some Wildstar servers are undeniably on the fast track to complete death. I doubt it's "deaf ears". They're just insanely slow. Just look at how long the most simple of bugfixes take. You think when working at that speed they have time to also overhaul critical aspects of the game quickly? | |} ---- ---- Plenty of threads on that everywhere. | |} ---- name one game that had a Mega server added that didn't go free to play? | |} ---- ---- Uh... that's really not an argument (also GW2 is still B2P)... I think you got cause and effect wrong here, actually. Games add megaserver because they need to make maps appear fuller because they're on their way down in terms of player population. The next step after that is logically F2P. Megaserver doesn't cause F2P I'm pretty sure, it's just a frequent indicator/precursor for incoming F2P. | |} ---- GW2 | |} ---- ---- There was never a sub for GW2. It was buy to play. Because people got tired of making threads only to have them locked or moved to off-topic forums. | |} ---- ---- It is an argument it's a bad public perception. People see there were merges etc. They assume dead game, assumptions of dead game = no more subs, and eventually leads to F2P And NCsoft doesn't keep their F2P games around to long profitable or not CoH is a good example. | |} ---- Says the super negative person. Yes, there are a few who want it all for free, but a majority of the people want a challenge. They don't want arbitrary means to exclude people from certain content. | |} ---- And... logging in to see a huge list of servers all at "low" after they were packed at launch will surely do wonders for their confidence? <_< Look, of course none of this is optimal. But I still see it as the lesser of two evils. | |} ---- ---- ESO. | |} ---- I think there's other options to explore first. More patches that aren't ultra drops focused on Bug fixes QoL changes and Polish, then when it's in a better state offer welcome back free weeks to all accounts not active, then if that bodes well a free week to anyone that wishes to try the game. If that can't get every server up to Medium then we can talk about merges. | |} ---- Aion is probably a more well known example. They were going to shut that down in the EU but Gameforge took it over. | |} ---- Only been out what. like a month longer than WildStar. ESO won't go F2P because it will just die... | |} ---- He said "added", not "launched with". But they've already proven they're incapable of fixing anything fast. This is just not going to happen unless... miracles. Or space magic. | |} ---- ---- Once again, you exaggerate Carrier. Thus far, you've exaggerated about: 1. Nerfs to warriors being too harsh 2. PVP ques being dead. 3. Dead servers (Bloodsworn may be dying, Pergo/Pago are not) 4. You being 1800 rating and above. You and about a couple other dozen delusional players who think they have the answers to fixing pvp/pve by posting poorly thought out, sometimes idiotic, game suggestions. Devs are listening, but they have to sift through all the garbage to find anything remotely applicable. | |} ---- ---- ---- I forgot how no MMO ever struggles with this. Where are you ideas? | |} ---- ESO may have launched with it, and it will die with it probably long before they even consider f2p ESO in my mind had the worst launch ever and was a supreme cluster after. the idea may have been great, the story may have been good, but implementation sucked and nothing from that game should be held up as an example of how to do anything. | |} ---- What about us poor PvE players and all our bugged/notworking/beenscrewysincebeta stuff? | |} ---- The nerfs to Warrior are to harsh without fixing our other abilities. We didn't ask to have one ability that doesn't suck and for it to be way over tuned. Yeah it needed tuned down but they're going to far without making other abilities better. | |} ---- Fishing Ultra Drop NOW. I demand it! :P But seriously, I think there are enough timesinks. It's just that 9/10 have a majorly frustrating aspect to them. Dailies? No variation, not very interesting in the first place. Instances? Bugs, crap loot now. PvP? I don't think I need to elaborate. Crafting? Bugs, unfinished professions (literally impossible to complete), extreme material grind. I guess there's housing. Which is obviously nice, but also not enough for everyone. | |} ---- Best way to get other abilities used is nerf the good ones until the others seem ok. Flawless logic! | |} ---- Warriors are fine. You act like you don't possess a ton of utility to go with that solid dps. Poor you. | |} ---- People like to blow things up and paint with a wide brush I agree on that. Now lets not start calling people names if you don't think the ideas are good just poke holes in them until people come up with some good solid ones. I can start with an easy one. People saying all the severs are dead. That is false mine is going fine. I find people when I need I run into people all the time. Now at some point we will have to merge things that always happens and that is not a bad thing but its way way to early. People want things right now right now and if they don't get it well they feel its a fail. | |} ---- No one is claiming the entire game is dead. Just some servers. As has been stated many times before: This is mostly "our" own fault because we couldn't sit out the launch rush and demanded new servers. But it's a fact now. My own server is... hrm. I'm not sure. The dropoff in players is definitely noticeable, but I'd call it "barely alright" still. | |} ---- Work on your reading comprehension. Where did I call anybody names? I said many players are delusional, that goes for both those in support or against the game. I also pointed out that many make poorly thought out suggestions, and that these suggestions are sometimes idiotic. Rational people sometimes do and say things idiotic. Where did I call the person an idiot, specifically? | |} ---- ---- Thats why im saying lets have some fun time sinks.. hell my brother would probably play if there was a good cardgame since thats his gig. Its the big stuff that gives us goals its the little things that keep us entertained. | |} ---- ---- Right, http://hpics.li/8c979a8 just to let you know, i carry my guild mates in arena's. So your argument is invalid. | |} ---- Screenshot your rating, post to imgur. Easy nuff, | |} ---- ---- They are? That's good news! Despite some of my recent posts sounding a bit negative, I'm far from being a doomprophet and I want to believe in the game's success. But no one can deny we need some fast changes and fixes. More manpower should definitely help with that. | |} ---- ---- I don't PvE all that much so I can't comment. What I can say is that 1800 gear is ridiculous and everything else is like monkeys throwing poo in comparison. They caused 3 things to happen. PvP'ers to just say screw it and leave, PvPer's paying people to carry them to 1800 gear (which is super common), or people like me screwing around in lower tier stuff for fun until Carbine quits sitting on their hands and decides to fix it. | |} ---- ---- This might have to happen if WS wants to keep people. I know some of the more hardcore types in the community will rant and rave about it, but I think it would be for the best. My first suggestion would be to adjust the attunement system. For 20m, there should only be mayhap 4 steps to go through. For 40m, 6 steps. And get rid of the pointless attunements: looking at the "Beloved with Dominion/Exile" requirement- I just don't get what that has to do with raiding. Same with the Elder Gem requirement. As it is now, I haven't logged in for about a week. I haven't really leveled anything beyond 22. Why? Because I look at endgame (not just the raiding side) and I'm reminded of the horrible mistakes a certain other game made early this expac. And it's not like I don't want to play, it's just I have absolutely no desire to do the grindy stuff like I did in that other game (talking dailies here). All I see from WS's endgame is grind, grind, grind (some grinds are okay; just not every little thing). I don't know- to me grindy just doesn't equate to hardcore. It equates to "Do all your chores and then you can watch the super awesome TV show." Sure, keep the raids hard, but at least make things less grindy. Just my thoughts on the matter. | |} ---- Unless they need developers that can fix the issues and they don't have them. /tinfoilhat | |} ---- Not a complete overhaul, but stat weights and itemization needs an overhaul. Which would then mean they need to re-adjust the assault power ratios for skills and overhaul that system. Which means they're a while off and it won't be a quick fix. Which is why I've chosen to suspend my account until updates. | |} ---- You paid for a carry (ironic considering your name). Also, if you are indeed carrying your guild mates in arena, then you're not exactly 1800+ are you. | |} ---- Pretty spot on. Depending on how well the fixes go, and the community response to those fixes, the game could carve out a nice existence, or even begin to flourish. As for the "Devs are Listening".... that means just that, they're listening. They're not taking orders from the vocal few that know nothing about proper game balancing. | |} ---- ---- Well, we can hope that they're firing all the cooks that had these terrible ideas, and are bringing in new people to implement better ideas. Same number of total cooks, but a pinch less fail! (Really close! Needs more: savory) | |} ---- It's over, Wildstar is finished. :( | |} ---- ---- First thing they could do is start deleting these stupid threads about a game that's "dying" That is genuinely what I think. | |} ---- ---- Covering up the problem and pretending everything is fine? Genius! This can't POSSIBLY come back to bite us later! | |} ---- So instead we go in the opposite direction and act like insatiable little sycophants. That will TOTALLY work. | |} ---- ---- It's almost like...going to an extreme...in EITHER direction...would be bad! Whoa! | |} ---- It's so true. But so many people lack the ability to calmly approach things, mainly gamers. They suck at that stuff. | |} ---- ---- They aren't listening to the wrong people, i can get that people struggling with timers on dungeon attunement, however if you dislike running something a few times to improve on yourself and your group, what basically is what you're doing in raids, how will you enjoy raids? You won't. | |} ---- Actually, in this sense, the extreme would be the people who left without saying anything. They didn't want to improve the game, and the game didn't improve from their silence. Are you ready for it? You're not. Here it comes: The people discussing things on the forums before taking action? WE'RE the calm ones. You weren't ready. I know. | |} ---- You can't even say that everyone left didn't want to improve the game. There are so many categories one could list. Life obligations etc. Some just didn't like the game and that's fine. Discussing on the forums is one thing, but when 9/10 posts are naysayers and whiny self-absorbed little nerds screaming fix this or I quit, you're way passed the point of calling it a discussion. I agree with you, discussion is great for the most part. But what is typically found on the forums is not something that'd fall into that category. | |} ---- It's still calmer than quitting outright. And yeah, some people might have IRL obligations that came up during the first month of the game, but I imagine that is in the hundredths of percent range. It's still better to allow people to air their frustrations than force them to bottle it up with no outlet. | |} ---- Maybe it's the moderators being boss, but I see far more discussions on whats broken, why its broken, and here's my idea of a fix than I see "Eff you Im out /rage" posts. | |} ---- ---- ---- It's called therapy. Read half the shit people put on here and how serious they take these video games, and I'd flat out tell you therapy is where they need to be. | |} ---- ---- And I can tell you, from vast experience with others, that if they're taking games this seriously, therapy is not an option that's affordable to them. | |} ---- Discussing it, in the one thread where they know to look is your best option. Creating 40 threads for 40 different complaints are likely to get lost in translation. Also, no one takes someone throwing a temper tantrum seriously. Act like you would with anyone else asking for feedback, or in the job world. | |} ---- Well you're right on that one. They could ask their mom. | |} ---- I like you. | |} ---- I was being serious. Classifying people who take games seriously as only children living at home is grossly inaccurate. There's people who for whatever reason have chosen to focus on their games, adults, people struggling to get by, and they invest themselves into those games. They'll skip meals to buy a new game, or pay a sub to stay with people they know. | |} ---- Semi-retired people who've done all they care to with life and just wanna relax and play the vidya... | |} ---- ---- They're treated as how they act. I'm sorry, I'll understand passion or hobbies as something one could get into, but a lot of people take it to the extreme. Acting like a child, and demanding satisfaction all the time is really setting themselves up for how they are really perceived. The real world will not be so kind to them, so I usually say to take off their dress, and end their little tea party cause no one gives a *cupcake* if they're sad in this world. Maybe follow it up with like a Nancy or something. | |} ---- Sounds like you need a hug. | |} ---- Save it for the people I'm talking about. I'm cool. :D | |} ---- lol, Rift had potential? Tell me more. | |} ---- That's the point I'm making. They retreat from the real world, and invest themselves into this one. It's a focus of what they're unable to do in real life for whatever reason. I don't think they're all demanding satisfaction, or that everyone who is complaining about issues the game has is in this situation, but this is their outlet. Anyway, this turned into a roundabout way of me saying I think being able to air grievances is good for player retention and blah blah it's like 8 posts back. | |} ---- ---- I reported a bug once. I said "Hey, this quest is bugged (insert details here) Just letting you know." And then I took a nap. . What I commonly read here is "This game is full of bugs, fix this shit Carbine or I am so *cupcake*ing out of here." | |} ---- Then the patch hits, they come back and all is well in the world! | |} ---- Not when what they want is available is available elsewhere and what they want is to water this down into another product. | |} ---- I dated a Chelly once, she was a raging *cupcake*. ^ Hint, it starts with a B. | |} ---- ---- That's lewd. | |} ---- Par for the course. :D | |} ---- ---- Very Creative. "slow clap" this man really thinks he knows everything, You don't know me and i don't want to know you, stop pretending you know me, period. Also i don't give a *cupcake*of what you think, i don't ask for your stupid "i know everything" answers and don't want your taciturn opinion either. not happy of what we think, move along forums are forums, welcome to internet. now process. | |} ---- ---- Stop insulting the players every time they die, generally to experimentation or a buggy-ass skill? Just a notion? | |} ---- lol it isn't in need of saving... | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- And on the flip side with PVP, Warplots are inaccessible due to the absurd 40v40 requirement. No more mentions of Warplots, its as if they've completely vanished off Carbine's radar and don't exist anymore. And now the brainchild of Warplots has moved on to other portions of the game to sabotage. The OP began the thread as more QQ, which naturally sparked a debate and derailment. He's since gone back and erased/changed several things. | |} ---- Have you SEEN warplots? Me neither. I maintain hope they fired the guy who came up with them and his job is one of the positions they're advertising for. They really need to clean the infection of terrible ideas out at the root with a slam dunk. Checkmate. | |} ---- They are so good in theory. THEORY... THEORY... THEORY | |} ---- Are they? SWG had a better system for it. You get a group together, you put down a base, you fight for the base with whoever you have available because it took time and effort to get it, and it attracted attackers by virtue of existing. Warplots? You schedule it in advance to line up 40 people on each side and pretend you're having a battle that's much more easily simulated in any random FPS today. | |} ---- I suppose, but the way me and my friends talked about it in beta. We were going to have so much fun... | |} ---- Hell, I invested all my architect daily data frags into warplot fabkits as soon as I could. Imagine my surprise when I found out how badly the idea failed? D'oh! | |} ---- You and me both. Glad I ended up switching mains. | |} ---- ---- I know that was a "big feature" about the crafting in this game, but I just couldn't bring myself to switch out a profession I had maxed. Didn't wanna pay the multi-plat whatever to go back to it. | |} ---- Agreed some good alternative activity competition would go a long way to keep people addicted to "shinies" busy | |} ---- Ugh, they didn't fire her, she "moved" to another department and now has a hand in overall group content. She didn't do a poor job managing and developing Warplots, it just wasn't the right time to waste developmental resources on something that is: A. Too big (40v40 with this small pop?) and risky to attempt at launch. B. Resource drain when PVP groundwork had not been completed (pvp gear, elo, beginning balancing). The onus lies with her boss/bosses who pushed this crap out to hype up the game even more. | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- When you wipe on trash for 30 minutes in GA, I guess you will be back saying "Make raid boss more accessible, remove all trash and just let us get to the boss." ;) Better yet, just make another Crusader's Coliseum, and have bosses come to us instead of the other way around. Because we all know CC is the best raid instance ever! | |} ---- Actually, all sarcasm aside it was awesome. Because clearing trash sucks. I want to kill boss, loot, and then log off for other things. | |} ---- To be honest I really like some of the trash inside GA. Reason? Well mostly because it's not like in other mmos where you just pull it and aoe it down, they actually have mechanics that are worthy of mini bosses in games like Rift :P | |} ---- ---- Why should endgame be pug friendly? before you answer that please elaborate on what you consider to be endgame in Wildstar? | |} ---- Dungeons/attunement. Yes i've been through it, done it completely. However finding a group of people from a guild to meet up at certain times doesn't always work out. Most of my friends quit this game after they realized it was crap to them. I'm on my way out of the door because you can't get a good dungeon run in with a pug(average) with 1-2 hours of play time. | |} ---- ---- Yeah so inorder to have a 10 minute boss battle you waste 30 mins on trash yeah i see serious time management issues and yeah i liked CC straight ahead boss fight . Now if the trash where just trash it was ok but these are like minibosses with no loot ,no bonus renown, nothing special but just to delay you. This is pretty much "time= keeps you playing more attitude " than a hardcore attitude. | |} ---- http://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Carbine-Studios-Reviews-E587246.htm | |} ---- ---- Megaserver would fix dying servers and faction population imbalance on all servers. How will this send it f2p? There are other reasons a game goes f2p and it's not megaserver. Anyways, I would like to see something done about win-trading and elo-abuse, more big battlegrounds, not the scale of Walatiki but more of the scale of Sabotage or good old Arathi Basin and Alterac Valley. Also some animations with the psyblade for Esper would be cool, it's just static and does nothing on your back. Except Concentraded Blade looks like it. Perhaps TK should look like you shooting couple of clones of your Psyblade instead of random swords. Housing items need to be interactive too, now it's just all dead and static. | |} ---- There's a lot to say for and against Argent Coliseum. Lack of trash was a nice change of pace, but it's also a warm-up for the coming bosses. Or at least it should be; the mechanics weren't related to the forge boss, but the fire elementals early on in Ulduar had fun mechanics(unpredictable fire tornados with chaining knock-up and the unquenchable spark). The vehicle segment of Ulduar was very instructional for the the tank fight in contrast. As technically interesting as the encounters were in Coliseum(and memorable voice work! TRIFLING GNOME! YOUR ARROGANCE WILL BE YOUR UNDOING! YOU FACE JARAXXUS, EREDAR LORD OF THE BURNING LEGION), the lack of unique art/models on most of the bosses, lack of an interesting environment, and no warm-ups or distractions of trash stripped a lot of what Walt Disney would have called "the show" away from the whole raid experience. Those points could have potentially been positives with the right angle or spin, but they were applied poorly. same environment: the floor falling away makes the 5th fight quite memorable, but there's a lack of change for anything in the first 4 encounters. A weather shift, noticable day/night change, audience freakout/fill-in would have been great. Even wall or arena damage for stage to stage. lack of unique art: Smarter particle effects, unique mix of uncommon spells in the game library, enchant graphics on boss weapons, there's no excuse. no trash: a good thing, but some of the fights could have had small trash enemies spawn briefly before a boss actually ramps up into full combat. The starting Magnatuar could have had snobolds start his fight for 30 seconds, the twin val'kyrs could have had a small wave of wraiths get you going, etc. | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- What is the issue with having things being more pug friendly? To me, having things more pug friendly (I'm not saying nerfed to hell and back by the way) encourages more people to actually try raiding. It opens the recruitment pools for those guilds that want to raid, but are having issues finding people consistently. Part of making things more accessible? Nerfing some of the attunement system requirements- at least for 20m. As far as raid mechanics go: If people want to raid, they should understand that wipes happen. That's a part of raiding. But on that same note, don't make it so punishing that it turns people off to it completely. | |} ---- I would venture to say that just being in a group with 19+ other people where you're not the hero is the #1 turn-off to raiding for most people. The attunement forces grouping on an escalating scale, which I think is definitely a good thing(along with other parts, like the week-split and other easements into commitments in general) | |} ---- ---- When reading the game's forums getting much more interesting than playíng the actual game, something really went wrong. | |} ---- ---- ---- Death penalties that matter(like losing your gear), more open world pvp stuff, let me rob peoples houses, and everytime you die, you have a 1/10 chance of that character being deleted forever. This will make Carbine successful because majority of gamers are like me because I said so and I make a better game developer than the actual game developers.. | |} ---- This game has been made already. It's called EVE/Darkfall Unholy Wars/to a lesser extent the first Darkfall. | |} ---- ---- I read through all the points and agree with them. Then I read 17 and realized that 17 would be easier than implementing 1-16 on a game that's already released. Dayum shame. | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- Forcefully halting progression keeps people subbed longer (until they realize that's the plan). | |} ---- ---- I disagree completely. Dailies already feel like a chore for EG and as of right now its the most efficient way to acquire them. Mists of Pandaria (WoW xpac) failed largely due to their emphasis on daily quests and their reward system. The problem with EG isn't so much how long it takes to cap it but how frequently you would need to do it and the length of time. Extra ability points/amp points is an absurdly good reward, but 9/10 months of capping EG every week is down-right brutal. It means at best my main wont be "maxed" until Feb 2015. Forget maxing alts. Forget "new players" they are already 2 months behind. What does that mean for world-first guilds, etc. I'm sorry but they pretty much need to change this. I like the wildstar "hardcore" mentality. Its refreshing to play a hard game. The flip-side is that there is no alternative. WoW had a regular and heroic dungeon - where even heroic was too easy. This game just has hard and hard. You could argue veteran vs. normal...but remember most normals aren't level 50 content and do not give level 50 rewards. Say what you want but an MMO requires the first M to be successful. You need casuals if only as adversaries in pvp, replacements for a group in a pinch, or at the least to buy your wares from the AH. WoW is in its biggest lull in content in years ...Wildstar really needs to capitalize on it. As I said before WoW is riding its "longevity" success. Many Wildstar players came from that game an basically gave up 10 years worth of progress to come here. If this game doesn't hold weight, they will just go back the moment WoW has new content. | |} ---- A lot of times I wonder if MMOs should go with the following route Have a red button in the corner called "I have hit my sweet spot" where the player can click and the boss will drop dead and give you the epic loot. This way each player can customize their level of reward and effort. | |} ---- | |} ---- ---- ---- Or Trion. | |} ---- I would say neither would improve it. | |} ---- ---- The thread says "to improve" the game. Please stay on topic lol | |} ---- Let me put this another way to emphasize its importance. Every two months you effectively gain another "level" assuming you cap every week .. so a new player now is effectively a level 50 vs. a level 51 (both of you in level 50 gear). Sept 2014 = 50 vs. 52 Nov 2014. = 50 vs . 53 Jan 2015 = 50 vs 54 ... so on. By sometime next year it will be 50 vs. 57+ (both in level 50 gear). New players will be at a colossal disadvantage. I understand Carbine is going to add an alternative to EG and that's great...however it will still be (11 - luck) months to catch up. It will have implications to realm first races for raiding and just recruitment in general. Implications to PvP rank (best ranked teams are "oldest"). I totally get new players shouldn't be "entitled" to be on equal footing as a veteran... I just think this is an area that is too inherently powerful. Also ... forget alts and/or re-rolls because your already behind. If your not sure you love your class, then you better re-roll quickly (your already 1 level behind). | |} ---- ---- I would classify it as a giant red flag, myself. There's quite a sea of them. | |} ---- ---- ---- This would actually be a great idea. It would encourage people to actually run the dungeons, albeit not for the first few days after the reset. | |} ---- That is a game I was quite interested in, just never got around to playing it. | |} ---- It had some great features, was very hardcore. You had to carry gold with you to do stuff, and if you had it on you (and not in your bank) when you left the safety zone then you lost it if/when a player killed you. Fighting with 15 people on boats was amazing, especially when you killed the driver and stole an enemy boat. | |} ---- It's interesting how people claim to want this type of PVP Experience but they won't play this type of game when it's released lol. "I totally was gonna play that" | |} ---- Can't always find time to pick up a new game, some times grown up stuff gets in the way. ;) | |} ---- ---- I never said you. Just a general statement.... | |} ---- ---- That's what I try to explain to people when they start wishing for the old days. I'm a grown man now. I'm not so quick to play games where what is basically my progress can be looted lol | |} ---- But did you like it back in the day? The kids might enjoy a good ole hardcore game. | |} ---- They tend to be the first to gank and the first to ragequit in those games. Absentmindedly carrying your whole bank with you into combat is a great way to find the unsub button. | |} ---- I like putting the keyboard on the floor, then putting treats on it, and letting my pups run up and raidheal in WoW. | |} ---- The combat style does not lend itself well to the 20+ keybinds I as using in WoW. Also, the rotations aren't really that complex in Traditional MMOs. What I wlll give Traditional is the CD edge. Cooldowns in Traditional MMORPGs are much sexier. My Medic CDs vs My Wow Druid and My Rift Warden is a no contest. Healing in Traditional (IN MY OPINION!) is less engaging but much better(AGAIN STRESSING THAT THIS IS MY OPINION!). You aren't as restricted. I can heal without looking at you. I have more range. I can carry the team. In the Twitch based MMORPGs I can't carry and in some I can be made completely useless... | |} ---- They will not. The kids don't play games as a form of escapism. They just want to have fun. I don't criticize them for it. They are also more social. They come to games with their friends. You don't see people grouping as 5 but if you pay attention you will see lots of 2 and 3s. I would love to see the stats for this. I was introduced to gaming in the Nintendo era. There was no Hardcore or Casual. Some games were just Hard(such an understatement lol).I'm not sure I liked those games or not. It was a game about Ninjas! I had to finish it! The Jaquio must die! lol It's nice to have an occasional Hardcore experience(Didn't we all just love Dark Souls? I did! beat it before nerfs!). Most people simply aren't going to pay 15 bucks a month for it. | |} ---- LIES! Where do you think all the "Where's my solo content?" comes from. They want the best, they want it now, they want people to look up to them and they wanna gank all the nubs lulz. When they get busted for ninja/being a jerk, they wanna transfer servers with a name change to do it all gain! | |} ---- Where's my solo content can even come from people like me who saw what a disaster forced grouping was in early Vanguard. For the rest of this I've seen those traits in both the young and the old. Age does not = maturity. | |} ---- Ok, you got me. Just being an old cranky get off my lawn type today. | |} ---- ---- Except for number 6, all of your points can be summed up as "remove the timegating". | |} ---- ---- ---- Counterpoint: DayZ, Rust, Unturned, 7 days to die. | |} ---- So... alpha/beta gankfests with no real game other than log in and trolololol? | |} ---- Yes. They are some of the most wildly successful games of all time. Dayz: http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/05/01/dayz-sales-surpass-2-million Rust: http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/02/10/rust-sales-top-1-million | |} ---- ---- But timegating is all this game IS. If you took that out... No man. No! That's crazy talk! | |} ---- Counterpoint: None of those games are 15 dollars a month. Plus what Chelley said. Also, those games aren't Hardcore. They are Griefer's Paradises and none of them are MMORPGs. P.S. shame on Zombie for liking that :P | |} ---- So basically you're agreeing with me? That people do indeed like full-loss games? You can also make the argument that DayZ/Unturned are MMOs. Rust/7d are definitely MMOs. | |} ---- Plenty of Rust servers allow more people to see each other and play with each other than wildstar allows in 3-4 zone instances, PLUS it's a persistent world. Pretty sure it's an MMO. | |} ---- ---- Nope, Rift did it and it was good, so wildstar can't. That's the golden rule. | |} ---- I thought the rule was rift wasn't #hardcore enough and is newer than 2004? | |} ---- ---- You could just be red-green and differentiation color blind like me. The color blind options use purple and orange, both of which use red which I can't see so they look yellow and blue. Y'all posters need to get on my level. #hardcore | |} ---- I turned the two options on and everything turned purple. I like it better that way, then I turned off all telegraphs because #hardcore. | |} ----